(update,
June 1, 2004 here
)
November
2002: The story is that there are two brothers - twins, apparently
- who are very popular on French television. Not only are they popular,
they are working diligently to popularize Science. Their point of
view is that people should be better educated in science, that science
is fantastic, that the study of mathematics enables a person to
frame their ideas with precision. The Bogdanov Brothers - for so
they are called - are advocates of bridging science and mysticism.
Like the work on this website, they are promoting the idea that
science can be very mystical indeed, and without science, mysticism
is merely superstition.
We
couldn't agree more.
The
Bogdanov Affaire started with a rumor that two brothers published
at least 4 bogus papers in physics journals as a hoax. On
or around October 22nd, a physicist named Max Niedermaier
- previously affiliated with the Max Planck Institute For Gravitational
Physics, Potsdam, Germany - sent an email around to a number
of people - including another physicist named Ted Newman.
Ted Newman - Ezra T. Newman - professor of physics and astronomy,
has been awarded the distinction of fellow by the American Association
for the Advancement of Science (AAAS). Newman, whose research area
is Einstein's Theory of General Relativity, is known for his New
Solutions to the Einstein Equations and the theoretical discovery
of what is now known as the "Kerr-Newman Black Hole."
In
any event, Ezra "Ted" Newman apparently fowarded the email
to many individuals including - it seems - John Baez.
John
Baez - of the University of California at Riverside - who says he
received many copies of this email from numerous individuals
- was naturally puzzled by this and apparently wanted to get the
issue out in the open. As a leader in the internet physics community,
John seems to have felt that if the Bogdanov's were innocent of
the rumors, the best way to deal with it would be to publicize the
matter by bringing it up on an internet newsgroup frequented by
physicists and mathematicians.
Within
a day or two, a science journalist Dennis Overbye, with the New
York Times, was said to have heard the rumor and was looking
for a big story. He apparently phoned the Bogdanovs to ask if their
work was a hoax. Their denial has been described variously as "huffy"
and "indignant."
Not
a surprise.
Max
Niedermaier then emailed the Bogdanovs an apology, which he urged
them to distribute.
Here
is an important point: Several of Niedermaier's statements are provably
false, about which I will suggest nothing, leaving it to the reader
to draw conclusions. According to Niedermaier, both Bogdanovs defended
their theses on the same day. His version of the story is that this
took place in a rented hall with TV camera crews and plenty of feminine
pulchritude in evidence.
That's
what Niedermaier said.
The
facts seem to be that the Bogdanovs got their PhDs at different
times. Grichka received his Ph.D. in Mathematics from the Universite
de Bourgogne on June 26 1999. He barely passed. On the same
day, Igor failed his, though he later achieved a successful defense
on July 8, 2002 - three years later.
John
Baez says:
I
assure you that the Bogdanov's theses seem like gibberish to me,
at least from their abstracts - even though I work on topological
quantum field theory, and know the meaning of almost all the buzzwords
they use. [...] Some parts almost seem to make sense, but the
more carefully I read them, the less sense they make... and eventually
I either start laughing or get a headache.
The story is best revealed in the series of email discussions that
have taken place on the internet over the past week or so. The first
public post on the subject is by John Baez of the University of
California at Riverside. John seems to be about the busiest mathematical
physicist on the internet.
From:
John Baez
Message 1 in thread
Subject:
Physics bitten by reverse Alan Sokal hoax?
Newsgroups:
sci.physics.research, sci.physics
Date: 2002-10-23 22:09:55 PST
We
all laughed
when Alan Sokal wrote a deliberately silly paper entitled "Transgressing
the Boundaries: Towards a Transformative Hermeneutics of Quantum
Gravity", and managed to get it accepted by a refereed
journal of social and cultural studies, Social Text.
But
now I hear that two brothers have managed to publish 3 meaningless
papers in physics journals as a hoax - and even get Ph.D. degrees
in physics from Bourgogne University in the process! The theses
are available in PDF format online, at least for now:
Igor
Bogdanov ETAT TOPOLOGIQUE DE L'ESPACE TEMPS A ECHELLE 0 http://tel.ccsd.cnrs.fr/documents/archives0/00/00/15/03/index_fr.html
Grichka
Bogdanov FLUCTUATIONS QUANTIQUES DE LA SIGNATURE DE LA METRIQUE
A L'ECHELLE DE PLANCK (Quantum fluctuations of the signature of
the metric at the Planck scale)
http://tel.ccsd.cnrs.fr/documents/archives0/00/00/15/02/index_fr.html
They
have also published at least four papers based on their theses:
Grichka
Bogdanov and Igor Bogdanov,
Topological field theory of the initial singularity of spacetime,
Classical and Quantum Gravity 18 (2001), 4341-4372.
Grichka
Bogdanov and Igor Bogdanov,
Spacetime Metric and the KMS Condition at the Planck Scale,
Annals of Physics, 295 (2002), 90-97.
Grichka
Bogdanov and Igor Bogdanov,
KMS space-time at the Planck scale,
Nuovo Cimento, 117B (2002) 417-424.
Igor
Bogdanov,
Topological origin of inertia,
Czechoslovak Journal of Physics, 51 (2001), 1153-1236.
(....)
Other
participants of the discussion wrote a number of comments that are
an interesting example of "winding up" the subject, as
well as expressions of frustration from those in the profession.
>Grichka
Bogdanov and Igor Bogdanov,
>Spacetime Metric and the KMS Condition at the Planck Scale,
>Annals of Physics, 295 (2002), 90-97.
This
should be 296 (2002), no. 1, 90-97. But yes, the paper is bullshit.
[Moderator's
note: Let's try to keep things polite. -TB]
I
hope to see one major difference between the aftermath of this
case and Sokal. No one should criticize the Bogdanovs for doing
this. This is a bitter pill that these journals and this university
must richly deserve.
(...)
You
may be able to convince yourself that "spacetime must be
considered as being subject to the KMS condition at the Planck
scale" is an intelligible scientific idea worthy of publication,
but the editors and referees at Nuovo Cimento, Annals
of Physics and the Chinese Journal of Physics
have a lot of explaining to do. Similarly for Igor Bogdanoff's
thesis examiners, who don't seem to have noticed that much of
his thesis was several identical articles stapled together.
(...)
Is
that really unusual with the 'publish or perish' ethos? Doesn't
everyone try to milk as many papers as possible from a good idea
by dribbling it out?
Two
papers and two Nobel prizes as a career total would probably be
thrown out by 'Human Resources' if the sucker went looking for
a real job i.e. "only ever had two ideas huh? - look at our
other applicant Joe Blow, he's published hundreds of papers and
got an MBA".
(...)
I
just heard from a physicist at NYU, who heard about this from
a colleague who was in contact with a New York Times
reporter who is looking into this. The "Bogdanoff" brothers
have degrees in semiology, their names and most else about them
seems to be a put-on (they are French, not Russian). For a recent
profile of them (in French) see
http://www.liberation.com/page.php?Article=58973
and for something about their TV show, see
http://www.france2.fr/semiStatic/61-NIL-NIL-173054.html
Their
theses and papers are clearly nonsense and the fact that they've
managed to get these things published and get doctoral degrees
should lead to a scandal of some sort. Whether they think of what
they do as real science or are doing this as a complete fraud
a la Sokal is certainly an interesting question.
I've
off and on thought about trying to publish a hoax paper on string
theory, but gave up on the idea, partly because while it seemed
eminently doable to make up some nonsense about string theory
and get it past a referee, it's not clear what the distinguishing
characteristic of my nonsense would be. Would it be that I didn't
believe it (this probably is not unheard of among people who write
string theory papers)? Would it be that the paper was inconsistent
and had nothing to do with the real world (that characterizes
most of hep-th)?.
Refereeing
in this field has clearly become a complete joke, largely because
there is no way to consistently impose standards given what has
happened in particle theory over the last twenty years. The Sokal
hoax had a very salutary effect on the "science studies"
people, perhaps this one will have a similar effect here.
(...)
They
have degrees in physics now... maybe they're aiming for a full
set?
(...)
I
just cannot decide what to think about all this. Can you?
(...)
Knowledge
is expanding faster than the quality control. Electronic pre-prints
are one attempt to alleviate the problem. A kind of refereeing
by mob.
(...)
Hmmm.
It seems a little extreme to me that a professor would be willing
to go along with the gag as far as a PhD thesis, never mind two.
If it comes out that this is a hoax, it seems to me that it could
be big trouble for the supervisor of the thesis. Getting a deliberate
hoax paper published is one thing. Getting a university to grant
a degree on false pretext is quite another.
(...)
I
took a look at this one:
http://www.iop.org/EJ/S/3/492/abstract/0264-9381/18/21/301/
and
the referee clearly didn't even glance at it.
(...)
A
New York Times reporter was planning to do a story
on this, but he spoke with one of the Bogdanovs, who huffily denied
that it was a hoax. Apparently the reporter decided to drop it.
He said he could write a story about a hoax, but not about some
papers that are so silly people *think* they are hoax. :-)
Of
course, not everyone committing a hoax instantly admits to committing
a hoax when you ask them!
Also,
the Bogdanovs are not only science fiction writers, but TV personalities
(or ex-TV personalities?) in France. It seems a bit odd to me
that two such people would suddenly take time off from their careers
to get physics PhDs and publish a bunch of laughably incoherent
physics papers unless they were "up to something". Am
I being too suspicious? Could they be merely incompetent? I was
hoping for something a bit more original.
(...)
It's
also amusing that their Annals of Physics paper
is almost identical to their Nuovo Cimento paper.
Of course, this cheap way of padding one's resume is nothing new.
As someone once put it: "It'd be plagiarism if it wasn't
me who wrote it in the first place".
(...)
The
physics 'community' should feel no more foolish than the sociology
community who were taken in by Sokal.
(...)
Mystery solved. They merely wished to cite the papers in their
next novel's appendix.
(...)
Now
I hear that the Bogdanoff brothers are claiming this is not a
hoax, that they are serious scientific researchers. It certainly
is true that their writings make no less sense than a lot of other
things in the literature.
At
this point, one of the posters wrote a bit about the PhD supervisor
under whom the Bogdanov brothers worked on their PhD's: Moshe
Flato and Daniel Sternheimer. As it happens, they were/are
good friends of Ark's. It is at such moments that one is allowed
to get a glimpse of the dynamic, and what we seem to be seeing is
a bit of the "scandal" principle in operation here - where
something gets a start, and dozens of people grab onto it, blow
it out of proportion, and it runs away like a train with a fire
box about to go nuclear. (no pun intended.) In any event, noting
the names of Moshe and Daniel, Ark's interest was piqued:
From:
Arkadiusz Jadczyk (ark@cassiopaea.org)
Message 13 in thread
Subject: Re: Physics bitten by reverse Alan Sokal hoax?
On
25 Oct 2002 21:34:51 GMT, thomas.larsson@hdd.se (Thomas Larsson)
wrote:
>Some
poor uncited soul wrote:
>> Even if the university did nothing official, the prof's
>> career is very likely to take a major hit. Would you
be
>> on the PhD oral committee of any of his/her students?
>> Would you collaborate with this prof? What do grants
>> boards think about it the next time this prof wants money?
>I
seriously doubt that Daniel Sternheimer went along on purpose
any
>more than Shahn Majid, Roman Jackiw or Jack Morava did. Sternheimer
is
>one of the founding fathers of deformation quantization, and
wrote the
>celebrated Annals of Physics paper on this in
1973 together with
>Bayen, Flato, Lichnerowitz and Fronsdal. What I don't understand
is
>why he has supervised theses that clearly are outside his
field of
>expertise.
>
>Sternheimer will hardly suffer materially from this debacle
since he
>must be past retirement age by now. Nevertheless, I feel sorry
for
>him, since he is such a nice and timid person. If Moshe Flato
had
>still been around, this would never had happened.
Ark
here: Although I agree with all the above, I am not sure about
the last sentence. A dedicated and smart hoaxer can find out about
the weak points of any person and even a group persons. Physicists
are generally naive and not suspecting. They are busy. If they
have reasons to believe, for one reason or another, that a given
student is a really bright one, working hard, and quoting
all the right papers, then there is a tendency to let the student
be even responsible for his/her work and papers.
So,
the responsibility here is falling not so much on Daniel, but
on the referees of the papers and the rapporteuers. The PhD would
probably not have been granted if the papers were not accepted
for publication in good journals.
Let
me add that sometimes it happens, for various reasons, that the
supervisor's field of expertise is far from the subject of the
thesis - and yet the result is highly positive. In such cases
special (extraordinary) attention should be paid to the choice
of the "rapporteuers."
ark
--
Arkadiusz
Jadczyk
http://quantumfuture.net/quantum_future/homepage.htm
Ark
was not merely defending his friends, Daniel Sternheimer and the
late Moshe Flato, he was stating something he knows intimately from
his own 30 years of experience in physics, mathematics, education,
and serving as a referee for several journals. Like many of his
colleagues, he has never taken this responsibility lightly, and
has labored many days - sometimes weeks - over papers that are sent
to him for review. His attempt to find a fair way to review the
matter - to take the paper seriously and given it a reasonable review
- resulted in contact from the Bogdanov brothers. Remember, these
are the guys that it was claimed that were contacted by a New
York Times reporter with designs on a story about a "hoax"
and who "huffily denied" an interview.
Well,
we don't know that it was a "huffy" refusal - but you
see how these things can grow with the re-telling. What is curious
is that it was said that "the reporter decided to drop it.
He said he could write a story about a hoax, but not about some
papers that are so silly people *think* they are hoax." He
really missed a remarkable story about the way science works nowadays.
Fact is, if the Bogdanov's work is silly, so are a lot of other
scientific papers.
What
is obvious is that nobody seems to be able to exactly describe why
they think the Bogdanov brothers' papers are a hoax. In point of
fact, as Ark has many times suggested: a LOT of physics papers could
be described by those who do not understand them as a "hoax."
But,
back to the word from the "horse's mouth," so to say:
From:
"igor.bogdanov" <igor.bogdanov@...>
To: ark@cassiopaea.org
Subject: Bogdanov
Date sent: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 22:30:22 +0100
Dear Dr Jadczyk,
As
everybody probably knows by now, since Oct. 22 we received many
emails coming from the whole planet about a rumor of "hoax"
based on reverse "Sokal's model".
We
were very astonished, my brother and myself, to discover that
there is a powerful stream of opinions whose action is to present
our works as a deliberate hoax.
It
is pure non sense.
Initiated
from France, this campain coincides with the creation of our new
scientific TV program on France 2 and could be originated by a
very ancient editorial conflict that had nothing to do with science.
We
have now identified the main source of this hoax rumor and we
send you here after the disclaimer of his author.
___
Dear
Dr Bogdanov,
please
find below a disclaimer that I distributed this morning.
Best
regards,
M.N.
______
Dear friends,
apparently
a private e-mail of mine to two persons was inadvertedly widely
distributed far beyond my 1-step consent. As the message triggered
a flurry of activity I feel obliged to add some disclaimers
to whatever `audience' it meanwhile reached.
In
addition to some by-and-large factual information the e-mail
described a possible scenario (`hoax') underlying the former.
Neither of them was based on first hand information as I immediately
stressed in a follow-up message to the two intended recipients.
Meanwhile Dr I. and Dr G. Bogdanov informed me that the `hoax
premise' is incorrect. I expressed my sincere apologies to them
which they accepted. I join them hereby in the attempt to confine
the uncontrolled multiplication of this incorrect premise and
the secondary rumors that followed.
Everybody
is invited to judge the scientific merits of the Bogdanov's
published work independent of their intentions on his own. Please
make an effort to distribute this message as widely as the first
one ...
Thank
you. Best regards,
Max
Niedermaier
______
As we wrote him, we were quite impressed by Dr Niedermaier's honesty.
His attitude reflects a perfect integrity and a rather rare capacity
to recognize that he may have been mistaken.
Here
is the whole story. But the main problem is the following : apparently
no one has really read nor understood our papers as shown
by this email from Harvard that was fwd to us :
______
Date:
Fri, 25 Oct 2002 10:10:29 -0400
From: L.F
To: L.F.
M.M
P.R.
L.G, JMM
KGr, FDE
PV
Subject: RE: Hoax: Alan Sokol phenomenon reversed
(fwd)
"
What is going on??? guys?? the claim is now that the Bogdanoff
brothers are not a fraud and that they not only won Phd's with
these papers that no one can understand, that yesterday everyone
was convinced were fraudulent, they won appointment as professors
to a french university, Bourgogne!!!
______
So
no one in the string group at harvard can tell if these papers
are real or fraudulent. This morning told that they were frauds
everyone was laughing at how obvious it is. This afternoon, told
they are real professors and that this is not a fraud, everyone
here says, well, maybe it is real stuff".
In
fact this affair reveals something extremely preoccupying.
It simply means that when a paper may be different from most
of the standard litterature (which precisely is the case with
our publications) it might fall into the category of "hoax
papers".
Therefore
we invite everybody in mathematical physics and theoretical physics
community to read carefully the referenced papers and discuss
them on scientific basis. Most of our contradictors are string
specialists. But we believe that there is room in topological
field theory for new ideas regarding a possible solution of the
spacetime initial singularity pb.
For
instance : one of the referees for Classical & Quantum
Gravity paper wrote :
"The
author's make the interesting observation that, in the limit
of infinite temperature, a field theory is reduced to a topological
field theory which may be a suitable description of the initial
phase of the universe".
So
what are your (s) opinion (s) about this question?
On the other hand, this idea to describe initial singularity in
the framework of topological field theory is based on another
new idea of our own subject to be discussed : the possible quantum
"fluctuation" of the signature of the metric at the
planck scale. The algebraic context of such a fluctuation involves
quantum groups theory as far as - at the Planck scale - the metric
itself must be quantized and consequently the signature should
be viewed as q-deformed.
So
the question is : what do you think about this idea of quantum
fluctuations of the signature at the Planck scale?
On
slightly more physical basis we also would be very happy to discuss
the possible KMS state of spacetime at the planck scale. We consider
that the expected thermal equilibrium of spacetime at such a scale
is a good ground for applying the KMS condition to it.
Is
it silly or does it make any sense (as seem to think the referees
of the different published papers ? )
In
that case, the context in terms of von Neumann algebras are type
II and III factors whose properties are quite interesting and
can lead to a better comprehension of the possible fluctuation
of the spacetime signature of the metric at the planck scale.
Once
more, we would be very happy to exchange views, critics, contradictions,
suggestions, etc. about those new ideas.
Thank
you for your help and attention,
With our best regards,
Ark
responded:
On
28 Oct 2002 at 22:30, igor.bogdanov wrote:
> We were very astonished, my brother and myself, to discover
that there is a powerful stream of opinions whose action is
to present our works as a deliberate hoax.
It
is pure non sense.
________________________
Perhaps
it is not so pure and it is not all nonsense. The fact is that
Daniel Sternheimer had no qualifications and/or expertise to supervise
your thesis.There are other facts as well.
Best
wishes,
ark
From:
"igor.bogdanov" <igor.bogdanov@...>
Dear
Dr Jadczyk,
Thank you for your answer. A precision : when (in 1993) we got
our first inscriptions in thesis at the University of Bourgogne,
our supervisor was Moshe Flato. As you know, he was the founder
of the Phys Math lab of the university. He was also founder and
director of Letters of Mathematical Physics and referee in numerous
math phys. journals. We were introduced to him by Prof Andre Lichnerowicz
who also was very interested by the links between mathematics
and physics.
The
subject of our 2 thesis has been deeply evaluated and discussed
with Moshe Flato. Obviously nobody can deny that he was perfectly
competent to be our advisor.
As
you also know, we had to suffer his brutal disparition only a
few month before the defense was planned for Grichka's thesis
(1998).
As
a matter of fact,while he was working at CERN Grichka was informed
by Costas Kounnas that Moshe had just died.
As
a consequence of it, Daniel accepted in a natural way to replace
Moshe as a supervisor for the preparation of the defenses (which
occured for Grichka at Ecole Polytechnique on June 26 1999). As
you can see by the dates, Moshe was the real supervisor and Daniel
only came at the end.
Anther question : you wrote "There are other facts as well".
Which facts?
Thank you for your help and attention in this affair,
Best regards,
Igor & Grichka
Ark's
response:
On
28 Oct 2002 at 23:22, igor.bogdanov wrote:
>
Dear Dr Jadczyk,
> Thank you for your answer. A precision : when (in 1993) we
got our first inscriptions in thesis at the University of Bourgogne,
our supervisor was Moshe Flato. As you know, he was the founder
of the Phys Math lab of the university. He was also founder and
director of Letters of Mathematical Physics and referee in numerous
math phys. > journals. We were introduced to him by Prof Andre
Lichnerowicz who also was very interested by the links between
mathematics and physics.
__________________
In
fact I knew Moshe personally, and I spent with him and Daniel
three months in Kyoto in 1995. I visited then in Lyon in 1996.
__________________
>
The subject of our 2 thesis has been deeply evaluated and discussed
> with Moshe Flato. Obviously nobody can deny that he was perfectly
> competent to be our advisor.
_________________
Unfortunately
this is not true.
__________________
>
As you also know, we had to suffer his brutal disparition only
a few > month before the defense was planned for Grichka's
thesis (1998).
_________________
Yes,
this was an unexpected tragedy.
_________________
>
As a matter of fact,while he was working at CERN Grichka was informed
by Costas Kounnas that Moshe had just died. As a consequence of
it, Daniel accepted in a natural way to replace Moshe as a supervisor
for the preparation of the defenses (which > occured for Grichka
at Ecole Polytechnique on June 26 1999).
__________________
Well,
I know what Moshe was expert in. The subject of your thesis is
far from his expertise area.
__________________
>
As you > can see by the dates, Moshe was the real supervisor
and Daniel only > came at the end.
__________________
See
the above.
__________________
>
An other question : you wrote "There are other facts as well".
Which facts?
__________________
See the above.
__________________
>
Thank you for your help and attention in this affair,
__________________
Best wishes,
ark
From:
"igor.bogdanov" <igor.bogdanov@...>
Thank
you again for your prompt answer. Glad to discover that you were
personal friend with Moshe and Daniel. You are in a way part of
what we feel as "the good old time".
Knowing
Moshe he would have been absolutely furious to be denied as an
expert in our field (as a matter of fact : in ALL fields!!!).
But
true, you are part right. He was our best advisor as far as the
classical group aspects and partly the quantum group section of
our work. But the main part of our work in quantum group theory
was supervised by Shahn Majid (since 1994). As far as the "physical"
part of the work was concerned, we were greatly helped by Costas
Kounnas during years.
Last,
as reflected in the "avertissements" of the 2 thesis,
we were also helped in depth by the other members of the juries.
Many
thanks and best regards,
Igor
/ Grichka
Ark's
response:
On
28 Oct 2002 at 23:55, igor.bogdanov wrote:
>
Knowing Moshe he would have been absolutely furious to be denied
as > an expert in our field (as a matter of fact : in ALL fields!!!).
__________________
No.
He would not. He could smell BS easily. He was very frank with
me. Always. Notice that he had Polish roots.
__________________
>
But true, you are part right. He was our best advisor as far as
the > classical group aspects and partly the quantum group
section of our > work. But the main part of our work in quantum
group theory was > supervised by S.M. (since 1994).
__________________
That
is one of the "other facts." I know M personally as
well. Last time we were drinking wine together in May this year.
I like him as a person. But personally I would not rely on him
as thesis suprvisor/referee in the case like yours.
__________________
>
As far as the "physical" > part of the work was concerned,
we were greatly helped by Costas > Kounnas during years.
__________________
I
do not know him.
__________________
>
Last, as reflected in the "avertissements" of the 2
thesis, we were > also helped in depth by the other members
of the juries. >
> Many thanks and best regards.
__________________
Best
wishes.
ark
P.S. I also know personally Lichnerowicz.
And
then Ark added:
Would
you mind if I publish our exchange on the web?
Our web site has about 10,000 visitors per day.
The public has the right to know.
ark
From:
"igor.bogdanov" <igor.bogdanov@...>
Arkadiusz
Jadczyk wrote:
>
> Would you mind if I publish our exchange on the web?
> Our web site has about 10,000 visitors per day.
> The public have the right to know.
>
> ark
Yes of course. No problem with that.
And
happy to know that you also knew A.Lichnerowicz : we met him during
our early times (1977) and became friends with him in the following
years. We did lots of things together with this great man (articles,
radio programs, conferences, scientifc commitees, etc.) He was
the one who pushed us towards our thesis and organized our first
meeting with Moshe.
Best,
Igor/Grichka
From:
"igor.bogdanov" <igor.bogdanov@...>
We
just went to the Arkadiusz
Jadczyk & Quantum Future : why are some websites great
while others are not?
We
loved the way you entengled all non homonogeneous informations
together in order to create a global meaning.
Speaking
of non-commutative geometry (one of your fields of interest) :
what do you think about our way to apply type II and III factors
theory to the description of the KMS state of spacetime at the
Planck scale?
Best,
Igor/Grichka
Ark's
response:
On
29 Oct 2002 at 0:48, igor.bogdanov wrote:
>
We loved the way you entengled all non homonogeneous informations
> together in order to create a global meaning.
__________________
Not
all love it the same way. As you can see, we have just received
a death threat:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/deaththreats.htm
__________________
>
Speaking of non-commutative geometry (one of your fields of interest)
> : what do you think about our way to apply type II and III
factors > theory to the description of the KMS state of spacetime
at the Planck > scale?
__________________
Although
my PhD was on KMS states and
although I met Allain Connes at CERN some years ago and I know
very well Rudolph Haag and Daniel Kastler with whom we discussed
similar topics, to express an opinion about the particular use
of KMS states you may have in mind I would have to study deeply
your paper, and that I can't afford now:-)
ark
From:
"igor.bogdanov" <igor.bogdanov@...>
Arkadiusz
Jadczyk wrote:
> Not all love it the same way. As you can see, we have just
received a > death threat:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/deaththreats.htm
__________________
Brrr!
Very impressive!!
__________________
>
> Speaking of non-commutative geometry (one of your fields
of interest)
> > : what do you think about our way to apply type II and
III factors theory to the description of the KMS state of spacetime
at the Planck scale?
"Although
my PhD was on KMS states http://quantumfuture.net/quantum_future/papers/vonNeumann.pdf
and although I met Allain Connes at CERN some years ago"
__________________
In
1996, Moshe created a scientific council around the genetician
prof.Daniel Cohen (he was at the origin of the decoding of the
human genome). Alain Connes was member of the commitee and we
had many conceptual and friendly conversations with him at that
time). We also had various phone conversations with Marinus Winninck
: in fact, he was supposed to be member of the jury of Grichka's
thesis. But the shedule did not play for it.
__________________
and
I know very well Rudolph Haag and Daniel Kastler with whom we
discussed similar topics, to express an opinion about the particular
use of KMS states you may have in mind I would have to study deeply
your paper, and that I can't afford now:-)
__________________
OK.
But if one of those days you have more time, we would be very
happy to have your opinion.
Best,
Igor/Grichka
Now,
what have we learned from this "event?" What are we to
think when "no one in the string group at harvard can tell
if these papers are real or fraudulent. This morning told that they
were frauds everyone was laughing at how obvious it is. This afternoon,
told they are real professors and that this is not a fraud, everyone
here says, well, maybe it is real stuff".
Are
Igor and Grichka targeted for their innovative ideas? Are they being
targeted because they are in a position to expose some of the serious
cracks in the foundations of science? Is there something in their
work that certain "agencies" wish to see buried forever
by associating it with the word "hoax" or with the "silly
papers" of the Bogdanovs?
Or
are the Bogdanovs really perpetrating a hoax on science - extremely
hoaxable due to those very cracks in the foundations?
Will
there be a television program about the idiotic Leaning Tower
of Science, and how it was pushed over by very clever infiltration?
Or will the program show the Leaning Tower falling over because
it refuses the very innovative thinking that would serve to correct
the imbalance?
As
it happens, the subjects of the work of Igor and Grichka - no matter
how silly the treatment they have given them - are rather close
to the very subjects of Ark's research. For this reason, he decided
to try to work through the problem with them. Will
Ark discover a hoax, or a Scientific Breakthrough?
Continue
to the dialogue...